Posts by Olin Moyles Ghost

157

I want to know whether 607 is valid or not.

by XPeterX in

jw
friends

i seek concrete evidence.explain it in a few words or post links that can contradict jw material.if 607 is a lie then 1914 is lie..

Olin Moyles Ghost

Peter, here are my thoughts on the answer to your question. To me, it all boils down to who you're going to trust: experts or the clergy.

There are scholars who have spent their entire adult lives studying neo-Babylonian history and archaeology. These scholars have examined the primary sources and unanimously agree that Jerusalem fell in either 586 or 587. For evidence of this, look in any (I mean any) encyclopedia. Every single one will say that Jerusalem fell in 586 or 587.

These same scholars use the same evidence to support their conclusion that Babylon fell in 539 BC. Interestingly, the Watchtower Society agrees with this. But they disagree with the 586/587 date--which is supported by the same scholars looking at the same evidence! That should tell you something.

Think about the motives of the parties involved. Neo-Babylonian scholars have no incentive to fabricate the 586/587 date. In fact, if a scholar were able to prove that that another date was correct, that would increase his prestige! But on the other hand, the Society has tremendous incentive to argue for the 607 date. Without it, the entire system of Watchtower chronology is wrong.

So, on the one hand, we have the experts in the field, with no motive to lie about 586/587. On the other hand, we have the clergy (the WTS) who must argue for 607 in order to survive and thus have every motive to discredit 586/587 at all costs. Who are you going to believe?

20

Ray Franz obituary in Atlanta Journal Constitution

by blondie in

jw
friends

http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/atlanta/obituary.aspx?n=raymond-franz&pid=143464974&fhid=5304.

raymond franz | visit guest book.

paid full name=raymond franz .

Olin Moyles Ghost

That's a nice obit for a true gentleman.

91

Why did you leave the 'Organization'?

by XPeterX in

jw
friends

in a few words.....

Olin Moyles Ghost

It was a slow accumulation of unanswered questions over a number of years. For years, I just kept pushing these issues aside, using thought-stopping techniques such as "where else would I go?"

For better or worse, I have a logical mind and little tolerance for B.S. Not surprisingly, this made swallowing the anti-science, anti-progress, bigoted fundamentalism dished out at the Kingdom Hall quite challenging at times. Eventually, the cognitive dissonance became too much, and I decided to really dig into the Bible. The main issue to me was the faithful and discreet slave. Specifically, does that parable give the Watchtower Society the power to make rules (over and above what is set forth in the Bible) for Christians?

I simply dug into the Bible itself, reading the scriptures in context. The more I read, the more I realized that the Watchtower Society's authority structure was built on a house of cards. When I mentioned some of my concerns to Witness associates, they recoiled in fear, using the "apostate" epithet. This further convinced me that I was on to something. Why would members of a so-called Christian group have such a visceral reaction to a fellow believer digging into the scriptures? It reminded me of the Catholic Church of the Middle Ages.

So, to answer the question posed, I suppose the reason I left the organization was that, from reading the Bible and WTS publications, I became convinced that it did not represent the "faithful and discreet slave" of Matt. 24 and Luke 12. In fact, I realized that the FDS doctrine was a transparent power grab.

87

Official: Ted Jaracz's Funeral Brochure

by yknot in

jw
friends

i received this generous offering from 'anonymous brother'.

his comments : hmmm...why do i not see such things at most jw funerals?.

please give your 'thank you' to "anonymous brother'.

Olin Moyles Ghost

Thanks yknot. Some interesting pictures there. Check out the top-right corner of page 3 with a young TJ giving a talk. Beside Ted is a chart of field service statistics. I've heard that, years ago, congregations maintained such charts on the information board--perhaps even including the statistics for each publisher. This is probably one of those charts--though it appears to be cumulative for the entire congregation.

21

Not Allowed to read other religious literature? Quotes Required Please

by ThomasCovenant in

i've tried some searching but can't find instances where reading other religious literature is discouraged.. is it true?.

thanks.

.

Olin Moyles Ghost

Thanks for the quotes, JWFacts. As someone who was raised "from infancy" as a devout JW and spent decades in the organization, it was always crystal-clear to me that reading "false religious literature" or anything that argues a religious position contrary to what the WTS teaches was off-limits.

Perhaps a brief experience may best illustrate how Witnesses view literature that disagrees with their views. Some time ago, I had a conversation with a family member who is a long-time JW, regular pioneer, has been on many assemblies/conventions (demos/experiences, not talks, because she's a woman), and is an expert on WTS doctrine. At the time, I was having some concerns about whether the Bible is actually inspired. I told her that I was interested in digging into the issue by reading what the experts in the field had to say.

She told me that there was plenty of information on this subject on the WT Library CD. I told her I had read that material, but that I recognized that the WT material was severely slanted in one direction, and I wanted to read what the experts in the field had to say. I asked if there was anything wrong with that. She responded that Satan controlled the world, and thus I should be wary of such books. She also related the experience of a friend of hers who was having some doubts about the Bible, but that after really studying the WT literature on the subject concluded that her doubts were unfounded. She encouraged me to follow a similar course.

I replied as follows "So it seems like you're saying that it's ok to research this issue as long as everything I read is on one side of the issue. Anything that argues in favor of a different conclusion is from Satan and can't be trusted. Doesn't that seem a bit circular?" She acknowledged that it sounded strange, but that it boils down to faith.

In my experience, this sort of mentality is not the exception--rather it is the rule among JWs.

9

the finished mystery and the DVD

by Paulapollos in

jw
friends

as i have been considering our modern-day history due to our new dvd, and the claims of alice and debator that jw's are god's organisation, it came to my attention that the food at the proper time that caused jesus to select us must, of necessity, contain much that is spiritually beneficial.

therefore, i thought it only proper to provide nourishing morsels of the spiritual feast provided by the lord's channel at the time of his inspection, which of course was primarily the 1917(?

) the finished mystery.

Olin Moyles Ghost

Black sheep: neither of them have been willing to admit that the WT was selected in 1919.

But this is what the WTS teaches. So, are these WTS/JW apologists denying this doctrine? If so, aren't they "apostates"?

13

Strasbourg court declares illegal dissolving of Jehovah's Witnesses in Moscow

by behemot in

jw
friends

the european court of human rights declared illegal on thursday a ruling by a russian court in 2004 to dissolve the moscow branch of the jehovah's witnesses.. it ordered russia to pay 70,000 euros to the movement's members.. russia's committee of salvation ngo lodged a suit demanding a halt to the activities of the jehovah's witnesses in moscow in 1995. the christian-based movement responded with a countersuit at the strasbourg court in october 2001.. in march 2004, a moscow district court dissolved the organization, which russia considers a sect, and banned its activities.

it said the "sect" encouraged its younger members to disown their families, commit suicide and neglect their civic duties.. the strasbourg court said the moscow court's ruling lacked sufficient grounds and was "too strict a measure.".

under the european convention on human rights, russia or the applicants have three months to appeal the ruling in the court's grand chamber.. the jehovah's witnesses, with up to seven million believers worldwide and 300,000 in russia, have already been banned in a number of former soviet republics.. the group, best known for its door-to-door evangelistic work, was founded in the united states at the end of the 19th century.

Olin Moyles Ghost

I'm glad the ECHR made this decision. People should have the right to believe whatever nonsense they choose. Stupid beliefs should be countered rather than banned. Banning the JW religion simply plays into the Watchtower leaders' hands.

59

Theodore Jaracz of the Governing Body died this morning

by Altar ego in

jw
friends

bro.

jaracz died this morning, wednesday, june 9, 2010 at about 7:30 am.

he was 84 years old.

Olin Moyles Ghost

lepermessiah: you refer to Herd as an "army man." Did he serve in the US armed forces before becoming a JW? If so, that would make two veterans on the GB (Morris served in Viet Nam). With only 8 members after Mr. Jaracz's untimely passing, that would make 25% of the GB U.S. military veterans. Kinda odd for a pacifist religion.

260

Who Are Your Past Circuit Overseers? It's a small world..

by mentallyfree31 in

who were your past circuit overseers?

i'm sure a lot of us actually know mutual people, as the co's relocate all over the country.. here's a few from the southeast us: (let me know if you recognize any names and post yours too please...).

ellwood johnson (new york/philadelphia area for several years also).

Olin Moyles Ghost

Ever heard of Kevin Wright? See http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/158681/1/Anyone-remember-this-former-C-O-Kevin-Wright

260

Who Are Your Past Circuit Overseers? It's a small world..

by mentallyfree31 in

who were your past circuit overseers?

i'm sure a lot of us actually know mutual people, as the co's relocate all over the country.. here's a few from the southeast us: (let me know if you recognize any names and post yours too please...).

ellwood johnson (new york/philadelphia area for several years also).

Olin Moyles Ghost

StAnn, you have a PM.